tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-60270916834524640102024-02-20T14:31:48.611-06:00The Oil Patch PostAt the local SIPES meeting, I was speaking to a gentleman who observed that many of the members were older and very experienced in their fields. He also noted that as these members retired, the community would be losing a lot of valuable experience. This struck a chord with me as I pondered what these guys could teach me about the oil and gas fields. Time will tell if this is a good idea or not. In the mean time, I hope you enjoy the stories and lessons these guys can teach us.Jay Leeperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01802892656137608150noreply@blogger.comBlogger5125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6027091683452464010.post-61966402339646953112013-07-02T10:13:00.000-05:002013-07-02T10:22:32.894-05:00TOPP Interview: Sally Meador-Roberts; Owner of Sonshine Exploration and Geologist<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>Welcome to the latest interview for TOPP. I was honored to have the opportunity to interview Sally Meador Roberts; owner of Sonshine Exploration and geologist. As an independent who own’s her own company, she offers us a unique view as she has to face not only the geology end of the business, but the business end and all the challenges that come with it. Challenges that I can personally relate to as a small business owner (Check out the new site. Click our icon on the right). I hope you enjoy this interview as much as I enjoyed visiting with her.</i></div>
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<b>JL:</b> Hi Folks. This is Jay
Leeper with The Oil Patch Post. I have
as my special guest, Sally Meador-Roberts of Sonshine Exploration. Ms. Meador-Roberts has been at this for
almost 40 years as a geologist, 24 of them as an independent Explorations
Geologist. Ms. Roberts was nice enough
to let me visit with her and let me post a few questions. </div>
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Ms. Roberts, is there anyone you’d like to say hello to?</div>
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<b>SMR</b>: Howdy, y’all! </div>
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<b>JL</b>: LOL! If you would,
ma’am, please tell us a little about yourself.</div>
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<b>SMR:</b> I was born in a small town up in Iowa. A town of 200. You never know where you’ll end up. I got my bachelors at the University of Colorado. My dad had always said the only thing women
did was teach and that was the Colorado State Teaching College and I was bound
and determined that I was not going to teach so I got my hours for my BS but
took my education and did a full year internship for teaching. I did this to fulfill my dad’s request but unfortunately
he passed away before I graduated. It
probably was a good thing because I went to the University of Arizona and got
my Master’s degree there. At that time,
every weekend was field trips and the only thing Spring Break was for was
weeklong field trips. I look back at
what a blessing it was and all the things we got to see. Well, we kinda fast forward to City
Service. I wanted to work for them
because they had a 1 year training program and I really wanted that. They only took about 15-18 people every
year. The training program was set as
they felt it was easier to train geologists to interpret geophysics than it was
to take a geophysicist and train them to understand geology. (It was an extensive training program – 9
months intensive geophysics,3 months advanced geology, land, etc. Classes I would rely on later in my
career. I have done LOTS of well site
work, trained geologists in well site work, LOTS of log analyses, putting
prospects together from grass roots to successful discovery, field development
of discoveries, consulting for other independents, you name it, I’ve done
it. As an independent you have to do all
your own data mining, drafting, writing, paperwork for BLM lands, state lands, units,
NMOCD and RRC hearings.) I don’t want geophysicists to take that wrong. Forty years ago, geophysicists training was
basically physics and not much geo. Of
the group, they (City Services) would find out who of us were pretty good in
geophysics and those who were better off in geology. At that time, we had nine months in
training. At that time, help in vibro-seis had just came out; the same vibro-seis that is now forty years old. We got field trips to the barrier reef off
the shores of Belize to digging trenches in the Colorado River down by Easton
to knowing the rocks up in the Colorado Rockies. We had to interpret dynamite data to single
fold data to vibro-seis data. At that
time, it was BC … Before Computers. </div>
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<i>(**laughter**)</i></div>
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<b>SMR:</b> The Seis Log was just coming out and we had to do that
by hand. When I was out on Drilling
Rigs, that’s what I did. They gave me
the log and I’d color them by hand and then take them back in. Now, all that’s done in seconds by PCs and
things. I had gotten to do a Summer
Intern (use to be called a Summer Hand) with City Service here in Midland. Being from a small town, in 1975, Midland was
45K. For me, that was a big city.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> Heck yeah.</div>
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<b>SMR: </b>I enjoyed my time.
I got to work in the Four Corners area.
People want to know the difference between a wildcat and a rand wildcat,
go work for Four Corners for a little while.
I enjoyed it. Like I said, I went
full time with them and got the benefit of the training program. We even had a week of training on report
writing for the industry. Probably, this
is where being candid and outspoken worked for me because I wrote them a nice
letter saying that if they send me to Houston, I’ll know they don’t want
me. </div>
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<i>(**laughter**)</i></div>
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<b>SMR:</b> My boss was wanting to recommend me to Denver. I got my Bachelors in Greeley, just north of
Denver and I really didn’t want to go back but I couldn't say that. I held my peace because there were two other
shoe shiners who wanted Denver. When I
was sent to Midland, I was probably the only person alive that was excited to
go to Midland.</div>
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<i>(**laughter**)</i></div>
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<b><span style="font-size: 12.0pt;">SMR</span>:</b>
Out here, I was able to go back to work in the Four Corners and Paradox Basin
and northern San Juan Basin. Broke in
working 4-Corners area, then SENM, Eastern Shelf, W/NM, SE Colorado, So. Utah,
All of Arizona, N. Permian basin TX, SENM (30Yrs in SENM).<span style="font-size: 12.0pt;"> </span>I got
to work with shelf edges there and work with some algal mounds and get my feet
wet. I also worked the north end of the
Tatum Basin and Permian Basin; Tatum Basin being the New Mexico side. I also worked the western extension of the
Matador arch. I got to work with not
only structural problems, but pinch outs as well. My favorite terms are the “Elida Highs” and
the “Insipient Ensleberg”. I like
that. That’s a case, too, where one of the
things I’d like to stand up and scream out to managers is “What do you think a
structure map is?” 30 years ago, 40
years ago, and even today everybody has to have a structure map. There have been so many periods of structure
movement since deposition and I want to say, “What does a structure map tell
you?” All it is is a topographic map of
what the surface looks like today.
That’s all it is. Is it important?
There are structural plays so yes, it is important. But, there are a lot of plays where structure
on the top of a zone doesn't tell you squat.
That was kind of the case working the Devonian up on the Roosevelt
Positive; the western extension of the Matador Arch. We ran two seismic likes up there and there
is a 1500’ fault as you come up out of the Arch and up onto the Roosevelt
Positive. It basically has three
brothers just under the Wolfcamp where on old logs looks like three
fingers. Very identifiable. We ran a couple of seismic lines; one from
north to south and one from south to north.
On one of them when they did the processing and migration on it, the
ringing in the granite lined up with the reflectors in the sedimentary section
and you couldn't see the fault. In the
other direction, the fault was “Boom” right there. It was an interesting enigma. There were very few sonic logs out there (at
that time). What we did was find a deep
well close to the line that we had and I took the sonic logs we had and I cut
out sections equivalent to the sections that we had and made what I called the
“Psudo Sonic Log” and digitized that. It
worked out really pretty well. Like I
said, that was back in the days where everything was typed into the cards. It took forever. But, it was a very interesting project. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> If you don’t mind, how long were you with City?</div>
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<b>SMR:</b> 5 and a half.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> Where did you go from there?</div>
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<b>SMR:</b> Harvey E. Yates Company (HEYCO). From what I was mentioning earlier, I did all
of this work on the cross sections to figure out what, when, where, and why the
Devonian Play was and the actual Paleo Crest which was where you wanted to be
on the Devonian was on the third block fault down. I spent two hours going through everything I
got and at the end the manager said, “Well that’s all good, but we need to move
the location two miles up here to the structure high”. Well, evidently, when I get mad my ears turn
red. My boss looked at me and said, “Why
don’t you go downstairs?” I was
livid. I got moved over to Coke County. They moved locations and they drilled
themselves a nice granite well. Another
company went and drilled my proposed location and got a Devonian
discovery. </div>
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<i>(**groan** … from me)</i></div>
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<b>SMR: </b>I spent the next 15 months looking at southern Nolan
and Coke and northern Tom Green. There’s
some super exciting things over there.
There’s a great submarine canyon that goes right through the center of
one of the fields. On the carbonate
shelf edge, there’s a beautiful surge channel. </div>
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<b>JL: </b>You know there are people who are going to call trying
to get info from you.</div>
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<b>SMR:</b> I’ll tell them that it was thirty years ago. Over on the east side of the Midland Basin,
there’s a spot where you can see the sands coming off the shelf and the long
shore current taking them to the south. There
is just so much over there on the Eastern Shelf. I said you could make a living forever just
in those three counties. The sad thing
about computers today is that the kids don’t understand that there’s other maps
besides a structure map and an isomap and if you let the computer make an
isopach map then I’m sorry but you’re an over paid geotech. If you want to write me and tell me how ugly
I am, go for it.</div>
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<i>(**laughter**)</i></div>
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<b>SMR: </b>Computers can do structure maps, but they don’t have a
brain. A computer can’t tell the
difference between an offshore sand bar and an algal mound. It just can’t tell the difference. If you don’t understand the model you’re
working then you’re probably in the wrong field. You've got to understand the structure and
the area that you’re working and the structural history and you've got to
understand the depositional environment of each and every zone. If all you’re doing is working on the Morrow
and you’re not looking at anything else then you’re missing how the Morrow was
laid down and why as well as the faulting that occurred as well as since
then. If you’re only working the Strawn
and you’re not looking at the Atoka base and you don’t understand the
depositional models then you’re going to drill you some good dry holes. I've seen them. There are ways to map on the Eastern Shelf to
find additional reefs. I spent the time
needed to gather the information to make those maps. Like me spending 15 months to make those maps
and then being moved. I was like, “What
are you doing!?” and was told that you have starters in this business and you
have finishers. There are very few
people who can start a project but there are lots of people who can finish a
project. I was told, “We appreciate you
starting this project.”</div>
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<b>JL:</b> That’s not
frustrating at all.</div>
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<b>SMR: </b> (**nodding**) They
moved me and put two geologists on what I had spent all that time working
on. You just lose all of the knowledge
gained. I could show you the Stripe Valley
Sands and the surge channel and submarine canyon. I figured out a way to map where there might
be potential carbonate mounds. People
have a tendency, if they are looking at the Strawn, to forget about the Cisco
and the Canyon that’s on top of it.
There’s just so much to do.
Anyway, because I was candid and outspoken I got to work the Western
Edge. I think what they wanted to do was
see if I could come up with a strategy to do that and I actually did. I came up with a strategy and trained
geologists. I had one week of experience
on a drilling rig and I had the most experience. Yes, I was the very first woman … let me back
up a moment … as a summer hand, I had a friend … let me back up even further …
City Service, like most oil and gas companies in the early seventies, were not
allowing women on rigs. I didn't know
that. I’m from a little town. I was never really told what women could or
couldn't do other than my dad telling me that the only thing women could do was
teach. So, fast forward, there was a gal
working there who was a district geologist and she had not been allowed on drilling
rigs. Well, I was a summer hand and
there was another fella there who was a summer hand for another company and his
boss said if you want to see one of the best gas drill stem test you’ll ever
see be at such and such location at such and such time. He asked, “Can I bring a friend?” The boss said, “Yes”, and I was the
friend. Well, I am very fair
skinned. I don’t tan. I turn red.
I was excited. I was going to be
on a drilling rig. It flowed, the flow
line froze, caught the prairie on fire … it was exciting! Well, I go in Monday and I was bright red as
a lobster and the boss kind of looks at me over his glasses and goes, “Hmm …
What did you do this weekend?” I got
excited, “I got to go out on a well and it flowed this much and caught fire..”
and went on. He just looked at me and
said, “Really”. I later found out that
he went right upstairs and told the bosses that their female summer intern got
to go on a competitor’s drilling rig and see a gas stem test. The female district geologist, within 30
minutes, got to get some gear and head out on a rig. I’ve been known to cause some thing to happen
like that. When I was on the Four
Corners on a rig up there, I was evidently the first female geologist to go on
a rig up there. Within 6 hours, everyone
knew there was a woman on a rig. It was
kind of like mines, if a woman was on a rig then it was supposed to be a bad
omen. Another thing young geologists
need to understand is that our job as geologists is to find enough oil to
replace that which is produced every year plus increase the average production. Don’t think this will last forever.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> You bring up and interesting point. Do you see this boom lasting a while?</div>
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<b>SMR:</b> What is
different now is the horizontal drilling.
The existing downstream infrastructure, which most geologists don’t
think about, hasn't changed. Refineries
can only produce so much. They don’t
have enough drivers or tank trucks to even pick up the oil. One company in New Mexico just bought a dozen
trucks themselves and hired their own truck drivers to get their oil hauled off
their leases. Oil pipelines are pretty
much full and I’m told the tank farm out here is pretty much full. There’s supposed to be one pipeline up here
by this fall that will ease that but right now operators are taking about a
$14/barrel hit just to get their oil picked up.
This means that if the posted price is $90 per barrel, operators are
only getting $76 per barrel. Now comes
in the economics. There hasn't been a
new refiners built since ’72. Environmentalists aren't going to let you build a
refinery. So, you have a capacity
problem. There may reach a point where
you don’t have any place to take your oil.
I’m a geologist and not a economist and I’m kind of afraid that if oil
drops down below $75 you’re going to see a whole lot of horizontals shut
down. Gas may come up. Gas needs to be at $6-$7, I’m told, to make
it cost effective to drill gas wells.
Still, geologists need to find oil.
If dry holes don’t bother you, you’re in the wrong field. You’re asking an engineer to take your word
that there is oil here and several million dollars are spent on your word. If you’re wrong, they are out millions
dollars on a vertical well. You won’t be
working very long. An engineer and I
found a company to drill based on my findings, but the engineer paid for a
science well. He spent a lot of money on
logs trying to get as much information as possible. If I would have been wrong and the wells didn't
pay out in 10-12 months, I would have caused him to go broke. It was either a bust or a plus. Turned out to be a plus. I've been blessed from the work at HEYCO to
go independent in 1989 at one of the worst times and the Heavenly Father
blessed me with enough consulting through my career to keep the bills
paid. I was able to put together enough
prospects that each one was successful and made the engineer some money. But that’s what I stress to interns, that’s
your job. That company doesn't grow and
the bills don’t get paid and employees don’t get paid if you don’t replace
those reserves plus increase them. When
you work for a big company, you’re insulated from that. When you work for a small company it becomes
real “in your face”. One of the first
things I learned when I worked for City Service is that we had to double the
reserves you thought you were going to get because the engineers were going to
cut them in half. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> I know you have done this for a long time, but do you think
there are still new discoveries out there?</div>
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<b>SMR:</b> Oh, it’s vast out there. So much to do and so little time. If you love the geology, I liken it to not
only finding the needle in the haystack but the reservoir is like threading the
needle. Once you have made a new field
discovery, you want to keep making them.
You want to find that reservoir that others don’t know about. It’s like playing “Hide and seek”. “CSI Geology”. I was blessed to get in on the discovery and
development of the initial Bone Spring carbonate production and kick off of the
Bone Spring sand production when I worked for HEYCO (Harvey E. Yates Co) in the
‘80’s. Because of log analysis classes
taken in the CS training program, I recommended perforating the 2<sup>nd</sup>
Bone spring sand in a well in 1984 – the well flowed 140 BOPD. That well allowed us (HEYCO) to do a lot more
exploration for more carbonate reservoirs because now we had potential sand
reservoirs in each well also.. Because
of a carbonate field course I had taken in the CS training program, I had a plausible idea for the
depositional environment of the Bone Spring that wound up being and changing
the way operators viewed the Bone Spring. At one point, we drilled 66 of 68 successful
wells – THAT is amazing by any account. This
allowed us at HEYCO to keep everyone’s jobs through the toughest times of the
downturn in the mid to late ‘80’s. Although
I was not allowed to publish any data, Ted Galowski, then with Mitchell, did
publish a paper that, for the most part, was pretty good. I think it is still considered one of the
best papers on the Bone Spring. To look
back and think that one recommendation to perf the 2<sup>nd</sup> B Sp Sand,
that engineering actually decided to do prior to plugging a well, turned things
around and, now, with horizontal drilling and slick water frac’s, has caused
what some call a “rebirth” of the Delaware Basin portion of the Permian Basin,
is something even I am in awe of. The
Heavenly Father truly blesses those who try to live their lives for Him. Secondly,
an Engineer I have worked with for over 20 years, was able to put together a
large acreage block on a prospect we had been working on for approx. 19 yrs.
(we got the 1<sup>st</sup> lease some 18 yrs ago). Recently we had a significant new field
discovery and are very excited. We have
multiple reservoirs to further evaluate and are super excited about the
potential of several of these. One has
the potential to be very significant. Talk
to me in a couple years. Another
highlight of my career was mentoring a young Geologist who now works for Concho
– Sergio Ojeda. What an amazing and
fulfilling few years! Even more
fulfilling is to watch him drill successful wells at his young age. I've been associated with 2 dry wells in my
time and they both about killed me. I
was like, “What went wrong?” On one of
them it was like a wildcat and it drilled out like we mapped it. What a geologist cannot determine necessarily
is if it’ll be pickle juice. We got salt
water. There was an argument among the
field people. The well was TDed 100’ shy
of our planned TD. I let my superiors
know they made the decision. A number of
years later on a farm out another company drilled out the other 100’ and found
the sands we were looking for. It was
there. Things like that bother you. When you drill a plain dry hole it’s got to
bother you. I always say, “What did I do
wrong?” I use a 20’ contour interval and
believe that if I can’t be closer than that 20’ contour interval then I did
something wrong. If I pick my tops, I
want to be within 5’. If I had one thing
to say to young geologists, it would be to know and understand your logs. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Agreed. Any other observations on what’s to come in
the oil and gas field?</div>
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<b>SMR: </b>Watch out for the
environmentalists trying to shut down the Oil Industry by using the Endangered
Species act and scare tactics about fresh water contamination. HOWEVER, that aside, there are so many
potential reservoirs still to be tested based on shows in older wells, based on
advances in completion technology, exploration for reservoirs heretofore
ignored. There is so much left to do –
and so little time!</div>
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<b>JL:</b> What are some of the main
differences between today’s professionals and the prior generations? Is this good, bad, both?<b> </b> </div>
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<b>SMR:</b> It is both bad, bad, Leroy
bad, and good. The main difference I see
is the use of computers. They really
started coming into their own in the 1980’s with the advent of personal
computers and, later, with networking capabilities and the Internet. The first mapping programs came out around
1984. The best one was a DOS based program
that, unfortunately was never converted to MS Windows. It had an internal database that allowed you
to enter data sheet tops, porosities, perms, 150 pieces of information per
well. It used USGS squares so could be
used in SENM w/out lots of problems or a land map. You could also import a land grid to use if
you wanted. You could use footage
locations, not XY or Lat Long coordinates.
Neither Lat- Longs nor API numbers were readily available in the ‘80’s
and 90’s. All programs can produce good
structure maps – whoopee! But even
today, none of the programs can accurately make Isopach maps, Isolith maps,
Relative Net Perm maps, etc. These maps
depend on the depositional model you are using.
These maps are produced using one’s intellectual understanding of the
formation (s) you are working with. None
of them deal accurately with faults, some high angle normal (extensional) movement,
some high angle reverse thrust (compressional) movement, some with lateral
movement (strike-slip). If all you do is
allow the computer to do the mapping, a good Geo-Tech can do that, the company
doesn't need a high paid Geologist for that.
You cannot do really detailed multi-well correlations on the
computer. I know they say you can but,
trust me, they know not what they say. Additionally,
with modern technology, the geologists really never have to leave their offices
to get data from the well site. It is
important for geologists to be out on location, to understand what goes on, how
wells are drilled, what the abbreviations on the mud logs mean, how to look at
samples and understand what the different types of shows are and what they
mean. How a well is drilled, the type of
fluid used, has everything to do with shows and with how the electric logs are
affected. Most young Geologists have NO
clue.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> If you could pass something along to the new
generation of professionals, what would you like them to know? </div>
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<b>SMR:</b> Your work and your word are
all you have, your reputation. Guard
them wisely. Ethics, Ethics,
Ethics. You can get sucked in far more
quickly and easily than you can get out.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> Any cool stories you could
share? </div>
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<b>SMR:</b> Several. Somebody chased me out to a rig one night.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> Why? What happened
there? </div>
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<b>SMR:</b> I have no idea. It was 11 at night. This car was going 20 miles an hour on this
road. I came up on this 60 MPH road and
they were in this dip and I didn't see them.
I whipped around them and they chased me all the way to the rig. I pulled around to the back side and they
pulled up to the dog house stairs. I
went up the backside. All the hands knew
me because I spent 60 out of 75 days on that well. All I had to do was tell those guys that they
chased me and it would have been ugly. I
didn't. I didn't want there to be a
problem. I just stood there. It was scary.
Another story was when I was with City Service, this guy, a landman,
came out and told us that this rancher really wanted our company to lease his land. It was out of NW Arizona. They came to me and asked me what I thought and
at that time they hadn't completed the topographic map of that part of
Arizona. I said that the only way we can
evaluate it is to go out on the ground.
I figured that would kill it as there was no way they would send us out
there. The landman kept coming back and
asking questions like what sort of techniques would we be using to evaluate
this. He wrote us letters and
fortunately I was smart enough to keep copies.
Well, we ended up meeting this rancher in the Flagstaff. We had a late dinner. He brought his sons which I could tell was
strange as they could go bear hunting with a switch. They weren't little. They were making all these snide remarks
about these big oil companies who thought they could do all these things and I
kept thinking “Something’s not right”. I
was sitting next to the attorney who was a gentleman of gentlemen in every
sense of the word. Part way through the
dinner I leaned over and said, “I need to talk to you after everything has
broken up.” He said, “OK.” I kept listening to these comments. Well, when he and I got together, what had
happened was this guy (the landman) had come to us wanting us to lease the
rancher’s land (202 sections) and was telling the rancher that we really wanted
to lease his land. He was playing both
ends against the middle. Every time we
wrote a letter, the landman wouldn't pass the letter along. He was telling the rancher stories about us
that we had equipment to test the land.
I showed the lawyer the copies of the letters and the lawyer said, “I
understand.” Well the next morning the
rancher was much nicer and offered to take us to his property in his private
jet by way of the Grand Canyon. What
geologist wouldn't jump at the chance?
He told his boys to drive with the intermediary to the property. I’m sure it wasn't a pleasant ride. The plane ride was awesome, though! I
could go on, but if you’re bitten by the bug it isn't about the amount of money
you make; it’s about the chase.</div>
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<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>We visited at great lengths and Ms. Meador-Roberts shared a great many views. In fact, I'm considering posting her and other interviews on an audio site. Ms. Meador-Roberts shared a lot of insight that is hard to put into text and her words do her own justice where my text fails. Still, I gained much insight and definitely could appreciate the challenges she faced.</i></div>
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<i><br /></i></div>
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<i>Thank you so much for taking time to read this interview. As always, feedback is encouraged in form of a comment or email. Also, if you have any questions for Ms. Meador-Roberts, you can email her at smrrocks@sonshineexploration.com. Be warned, if you're going to try to get secret info out of her she is pretty cagey! </i></div>
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<i><br /></i></div>
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<i>Take care and I hope to see you on the oil patch!</i></div>
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Jay Leeperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01802892656137608150noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6027091683452464010.post-53619016231650183592013-06-02T16:44:00.001-05:002013-06-02T16:44:23.322-05:00TOPP Interview: David Cromwell, Incoming President of the WTGS and Geologist for BC Operating<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>Hello guys and gals.
This is Jay Leeper with The Oil Patch Post. I have as my guest for today Mr. David
Cromwell, Geologist with BC Operating and Incoming President of the West Texas
Geological Society. Mr. Cromwell has
been a geologist in the west Texas area for close to 40 years and was nice
enough to sit down with me to offer some insight in the Oil & Gas Field. I knew his schedule was very busy and was
appreciative that he took time to visit with me late into the day. I also appreciate that he took an educational
perspective to his approach of the business.
It appealed to the Educator in me and resonated the value of a person
taking initiative to seek self improvement.</i></div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>I hope you enjoy the interview.</i></div>
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<br /></div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
JL: Dave, would you
like to say “Hi” to everybody?</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
DC: (With a wave) Hi!</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
JL: As we get started, would you mind telling everybody a little
about yourself and maybe some of what you've done in the field?</div>
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<br /></div>
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DC: This is Dave
Cromwell. I got my undergraduate from
the University of California in 1969.
Spent 3 years in the Army. Got
out and went to graduate school in Oklahoma.
After 2 years, I got my masters and started in 1974 with AMOCO in
Houston. I started working the Permian
Basin with AMOCO then started working the Permian Basin for the next 40
years. I came to Midland in 1976 with Bass
Enterprises and Production Company. I've
worked with several companies and have been laid off twice in my career. Some of those times were pretty long in
between jobs but always worked my way back in.
Always been in the business. I've
been on the fringes sometimes doing mud logging, chasing core, whatever I could
to keep active out here. I’ve seen
several cycles come and go. I’ve enjoyed
it. This is a great time for the oil
industry and a great time to be involved.
</div>
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JL: Very cool. I know
you’ve been in the industry for a long time.
What characteristics do you believe helps make a geologist successful in
this industry?</div>
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<br /></div>
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DC: Well, basically ,Jay, I consider 4 criteria to be a good
geologist. The first is a good
technical, sound background in the science.
The second is a personality that is optimistic. Thirdly, a personality that is creative. Fourthly, you have to have a little
luck. Those first three criteria kind of
define who you are and how you go about this business. Staying technical is very critical. As I’ve gotten along in my experience the
terminology has changed, new ideas have come and gone, the science has improved
considerably but if you don’t stay technical you’ll find yourself in a lot of
hot water. I don’t mean technical by
becoming savvy with just the computer. I’m
talking about in the science itself. One
of the main venues to keep you technical is to join the societies that are
available to us. For us, that’s the West
Texas Geological Society (WTGS) and the Permian Basin Section of the SEPM that
are both local here. Also, to be
involved in the regional as well as the South West Section of the AAPG and even
going to the national meetings every once in a while. The basics for us in a provincial sense are
the local societies that offer continuing education, field trips, and a monthly
meeting. All are good in keeping our
minds active in what’s going on in the Permian Basin. </div>
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JL: Didn’t you just get back from the Nationals?</div>
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DC: I just got back from Pittsburg this week. A lot of the talks there were centered on
shale. I enjoyed it although the talks
were somewhat regionalized.
Marcelles. Bakkin. There were some good posters and information
on the Permian Basin. It was good to
visit with those people. Like I’ve often
said, you know, I’ll often go to Pittsburg or Houston to meet people from
Midland. It’s always good to meet old
friends and visit with new ones. I met
with a friend of mine that I worked with at Energen and had lunch
together. That’s just an example of
keeping up with people as well as keeping abreast of the technical side of
things which is important. I think
things have changed for the geologist since I started working nearly 40 years
ago. For one thing communication has
been very much to the betterment of the geologist and what’s happening
on-site. With the satellite radios and
telephones today communication is just wonderful. You get to take a look at the mud logs in almost
real time whereas before that you were lucky if you got to see a mud log once a
week because of snail mail. As a mud logger,
I had to go into town and fax at the local truck stop twenty years ago. Before that even talking to the rig was
nearly impossible with the dead areas going on.
Then they came out with the special phones and then bag phones so there’s
been a progression that’s improved dramatically your ability to find out what’s
going on out on the rig. Now, computers
have played an important part in the improvement of the geologist because you
have so much data that’s being entered into the computer whether it be well
logs or mud logs or scout ticket data that’s accessible at your fingertips as
well as the services that you can subscribe to to get that data that helps you
to do your job. You can use the data to
generate structure maps, isopack maps, or whatever in between maps you’re
interested in. I think, that being said,
I don’t think there is any substitute for a geologist contouring his own map
and adding the geological bias he feels is prevelant in that particular area
and what’s going on. To me, a computer
map is a regional generated map that can help you in a broad sense but the nuts
and the bolts of everything are depending on you as the geologist to make your
interpretation to contour your map accordingly.
So, those two things have dramatically have improved the ways us
geologists have moved forward in the almost 40 years I have been involved in
the business. I feel very fortunate that
I have been around to experience that. </div>
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JL: What are some of
the differences you have seen between the generations of oil professionals?</div>
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DC: Well, I mentioned that computers have changed the way we
do the business, and to a certain extent I feel the young professionals rely on
the computer too much. They’ll get the
data output from the computer and think it is the gospel so to speak. Basically, you have to remember that the
computer is only as good as the data that was put into it. If you get bogus data in then you’re going to
get misinterpretation of the information.
I think it’s incumbent of the younger geologist to take a second look
at the data that’s generated and verify
that data by hand checking their wells to see if they agree and also to double
check some of the surrounding wells. Correlations
are very complicated especially in a stratographic basin where the lithologies
are changing between the limes and shales and sands so that it makes correlating
difficult. There are some good services
that have done a admirable job to make correlations reasonable but I think it’s
incumbent on the geologist to A) double check their work especially after an
initial map has been generated so that they understand what the data represents
and like I mentioned earlier B) go in and fine tune the map into a smaller area
so that you contour it yourself adding your bias and interpretations. If you’re correlating deep water sands
perpendicular to the strike line and you know your sands are meandering into
the basin so that you need to understand that near shore parallax systems where
the sand lines are parallel to the strike line.
There’s a big 90 degree difference on how that sand body can be interpreted. If you understand the nature of the sands for
example is the Turberdite then it’s going to flow into the basin, bifurcate as
it gets into the basin further down slope and where you are losing your
differential energy and it helps you to understand that you need a bias on the
isopack maps to reflect your interpretation.
A computer may or may not do that.
Some programs can add a little bit of bias to it but can’t substitute
what you think it should be and how you think those contours ought to go. </div>
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JL: So how is a new professional to get better at what they
do?</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
DC: Well, like I mentioned, they need to get current on the
new technologies coming out and they also need to understand other disciplines
as well. Everyone is talking about the
team concept now where you’re working with land men and engineers, geophysists,
as well as management to get your point across.
I think it’s important for a geologist to be in communication and
understand the other disciplines that others have that compose your team. Not necessarily to know their details but to
have a general understanding of what everyone can bring to the table. It’s also important to remember that the
whole business is price driven.
Unfortunately we don’t control the price. So you’re in a situation where you’re in a
reactionary mode. Like I said, I’ve been
laid off twice in my career; both times after a bust. I think the current status here is that
things are going good and personally I feel that the Wolfberry Play, for
example, is a valid play that has a lot of technical merit to it. You’ll see it move forward. I also think that if you see oil get below
$70 a barrel and it stays below that where the hedges start wearing off
companies will start moving their hedges around I think you’re going to find
things will slow down here considerably.
That’s just my personal opinion on the Wolfberry. I think it’s more price sensitive that say
the Wolfbone, Bonespring, or Wolfcamp formation play that you have going on in
the Delaware. I think it’s a little more
economic than the Wolfberry play. But
when you’re spending $8-$10 million for a lateral well it takes a lot of
reserves to recover that and so reserves are dollars and dollars are what
drives the business. I think this play
is going to go on for quite a while.
This is kind of a different play because everyone is using the term “resource”
play. What does “resource” mean? Does that “resource” mean provincial everywhere?
No. There are going to be sweet spots in
every resource play. This is Mother
Nature you’re dealing with. Lithologies
change, the Earth is a dynamic system. I
was taught that 3 things define a reservoir and that’s source, seal, and
trap. Right now with a resource play,
your source is your reservoir. You got
rock that you’re looking at that’s very low in porosity and permeability that you’re
trying to get the oil out of. With the
new techniques like horizontal drilling and high horsepower, high volume frack
jobs are able to access the nano-pores (if you will) to recover quite a bit of
the oil in place. From a Permian Basin
perspective, I think the economy is here to stay for quite a while. It’s encouraging to see the US become less dependent
on the foreign oil reversing the depletion trend that has been going on up
until the last 4-5 years. Since I’ve
been involved in the business, we are just now seeing resource plays
contributing to the trends. </div>
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<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>As the evening wore down I could see the enthusiasm and
passion that seem to be a common factor for those who seem to be successful in
this line of work and showed no signs of dimming even as the time passed. You could tell that Dave loves what he does
and still has a lot to offer. Part of me
wondered if this is what the young professional could take; to love the work
and not be in it for the pay. I keep
liking a geologists job to that of a detective in a novel. How do you take the information you have and find
something you can’t see in a place you can never go? It’s amazing to the layman.</i></div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>Thank you for taking time to read my little blog. If you would like to contact David Cromwell,
his email is <a href="mailto:DCromwell@BCOperating.com">DCromwell@BCOperating.com</a>. He would be glad to answer any questions and
clarify. I consider him an excellent
resource for people to reach out to if you have questions or want advice.</i></div>
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<br /></div>
<br />
<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>Take care, all, and I hope to see you somewhere on The Oil
Patch!</i></div>
Jay Leeperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01802892656137608150noreply@blogger.com0tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6027091683452464010.post-85046154540739196232013-04-28T16:14:00.002-05:002013-05-08T09:04:25.793-05:00TOPP Interview: Ted Gawloski, Chief Geologist for Resolute Energy<br />
<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>Many thanks in advance
for checking out this little blog. It
never ceases to amaze me at the reception and feedback I have received in
getting this endeavor off the ground. One example is one of the officers of the West
Texas Geological Society, Geophysicist for Concho Resources Sergio Ojeda. He was one of the folks encouraging the need
for The Oil Patch Post and even recommended me speaking to a great guy, expert
exploration geologist and one of Sergio’s former mentors who is this post’s
guest; Mr. Ted Gawloski, Chief Geologist for the Permian Basin branch of
Resolute Energy.<o:p></o:p></i></div>
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<i><br /></i></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<i>I recently had the privilege
of meeting Mr. Gawloski at his office where he took time out of his busy
schedule to visit with me about the focus of this blog. He definitely struck me as a kind person, but
there was no mistaking his passion and confidence as we spoke. I found myself drawn into the interview where
I took a lot out of his words. As a
fellow academic, Ted is credited with writing one of the only papers on The
Bone Spring Fields and the Morrow Sands Fields.
Last September, Ted was a guest speaker at the WTGS Symposium where he
spoke about the Abo Play in New Mexico and the possible implications of it
extending into Texas. Even before the
interview started, Ted definitely had a clear view on what he hoped to pass on
to the newer oil professionals. At
times, I found my own perceptions challenged by Ted’s views; however, I am
forced to admit that Ted’s points are valid and in the end revealed to me ways
I can improve my understanding of the oil and gas landscapes.<o:p></o:p></i></div>
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<i>I hope that you can
get as much out of this interview as I did.<o:p></o:p></i></div>
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<i>*************************************************************************<o:p></o:p></i></div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>JL:</b> Hello ladies and
gentlemen. This is Jay Leeper with The
Oil Patch Post. I have the privilege of
speaking today with Mr. Ted Gawloski, Chief Geologist for the Permian Basin with
Resolute Energy and author of papers for the Bone Spring and Marrow Sands Fields. Mr. Gawloski has agreed to talk with me and
now is as good a time as any to begin with the questions.</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>TG: </b> Sure.</div>
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<b>JL: </b> First off, did I
get the official title correct?</div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>TG: </b>That is correct.</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>JL:</b> Great! When did
you first get into the field?</div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>TG:</b> Back in 1981. I
started out working for Amoco down in Houston but I was working the Permian
Basin. I’ve actually worked the Permian
Basin since 1981. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Good Lord.</div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>TG:</b> (nods) A long time. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Job experiences?
I mean, since 1981 that’s been 32-33 years?</div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>TG:</b> About 33 years.
Quite a bit.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> What companies
have you worked with?</div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>TG: </b> I guess I started
out with Amoco like a lot of people.
They were really good about training people. I got in with the guy making all the field
trips so I got to go when people couldn't go.
I spent a lot of time out there in the field and in school and
stuff. It was a great learning
experience. The Majors trained half the
people in this town. They did it knowing
that a lot of them would leave. I left
because my wife was actually a geologist working for Exxon at the same time but
she got a job out here so we moved to Midland in 1984. I got a job with Mitchell Energy at that
point at a time when it was actually pretty hard to get a job. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> No joke.</div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>TG:</b> It was right then that things were starting to fall
apart (for the O&G business). I managed to hang in there. We did a lot of good things over at Mitchell
Energy. We built this district up buying
lease holds into sales and working up prospects. We made it work for 10 solid years until they
had a downturn and ended up shutting the office down. It was one of those things. Now, I already had another job lined up and
was ready to go. I used it as a step-up
point to work for another company here in town, Concho, which people really
know is a great success story for this community here. I was one of the 20 people who started Concho
3 and now they have over 800 people working for them. They have one of the largest daily production
of any company working here in the Permian Basin and they are headquartered
here. That was a really neat company to
work for. I was with them for 5-6
years. I then came over to work for
Apache for a little while. However, I
really felt like I needed to get back into … well I had an opportunity to start
an office (Resolute Energy) and grow it and I always wanted to do that. For someone my age to take a leap like that
and do that was a little difficult to do but I’m glad I did it. I’m here at the beginning and helping them
start something in town and I told them this was the way you had to do business
here in town. If you were going to do
business here in the Permian Basins then you had to come here and build here. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Resolute is headquartered in Denver, right?</div>
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<br /></div>
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<b>TG:</b> Right. We had 3
people in the office last summer and now we have over 35. We closed on a deal and things are starting
to take off. Business is pretty tough
around here. It’s a pretty competitive business. </div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>JL:</b> Agreed. I can definitely
relate. If you don’t mind, I know you
have been doing this a long time and accomplished many things but what do you
still hope to accomplish and achieve in your career?</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>TG: </b> I’m still trying
to find that one elusive thing nobody else has found yet. The way the Basin has been developed that is
a really difficult thing to do because almost every section has some
potential. The key is lease hold. That’s the hardest part to do right now because
the oil is out there and extracting it is a little difficult to do but you have
to have acreage to even get started. Every
day there are people coming in here with a fist full of money, and investor,
and it’s amazing. This town has changed
dramatically in such a short time. </div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>JL:</b> True. If you don’t
mind, being that you have been here so long and involved in the business, what
changes do you see still to come in the oil and gas business; especially in the
Permian Basin?</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>TG: </b>With the Permian Basin, I call it a Renaissance going on
right now. It’s not just a change. It’s flipped the whole thing around. It’s going to last for as long as we can
produce the oil. There are so many
locations and so many different zones stacked one on top of the other. It’s going to take years to develop it even
with all these people coming in. It’s
amazing what is now productive with the technology. It makes it really interesting trying to map
something like this as opposed to the conventional reservoir we have always
been mapping and it takes a little different look at it. You have to look at it completely
different. With the conventional stuff,
you look at a log and find a pay zone and you go and map it. Here you go and use all these different
parameters and stuff. You have to do a
lot of work and the economics have to be always in balance. It’s fun to see. It’s amazing.
Just when you think the dog’s down getting kicked it just gets right
back up and starts barking. You get
after it. It’s fun. </div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>JL:</b> I remember before we started recording this interview
you made mention about having the passion for doing what you’re doing;
especially for as long as you’ve been doing it.
Regarding the newer professionals, what are some of the differences you
note between today’s professionals and the professionals from your generation?</div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>TG:</b> There’s a big difference. A lot of the differences come from the advent
of the computer age. Of the geologists
today, there are only a few who still do this (how he does exploration geology). To actually go out to the field and actually
look at the samples and the rocks … you cannot understand what’s going on
unless you actually go out there. I
cannot tell you how many times I have gone out there and every time I do I learn
something new. I was fortunate to have
loggers that I knew that were actually geologists that knew more about the
wells than I did. They were
amazing. They weren’t just someone that
wrote down a few simple, little words.
They detailed a section. I
learned a lot from those guys. I
appreciated what they did. You just can’t
beat going out there looking at samples.
You can see it on a log and say this is what it is but you don’t know
what the show looks like or the intricacies of what it looks like. There is a zone out there in New Mexico, the Delaware
Sands, it’s so fine grained and well rounded that half the time in the show the
samples float and go away. If you don’t
stir it up or look at it carefully or quick enough you won’t know you were in a
zone and you went right by it. It’s
little things like that that you learn what’s going on. There was no bigger rush what when you heard
a drilling brake squeaking in the middle of the night. You’re waiting on a pay zone and you pop up
waiting for that sample pacing the trailer waiting for that sample to come
up. And if you hit it right you just
felt so good! You actually see the rock
coming up from 13,000’. It’s something
you can’t get off the computer. I
realize that you can’t do it as easily and people are really busy but there are
still a few people who do it. A guy I
helped mentor, he’s a young guy, and he went out into the field and
learned. He knew the importance of
it. You can tell that he has a drive for
it. And the same thing for the electric
logs. You can get them over here (in the
office) but you don’t really know what’s going on. There are a lot of things that go on out in
the field that you don’t know. </div>
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<br /></div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<b>JL:</b> You mentioned the Bone Spring earlier. You did a paper on that area, right?</div>
<div class="MsoNormal">
<br /></div>
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<b>TG:</b> One of the few comprehensive papers. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Can you talk to me a little bit about that?</div>
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<b>TG:</b> It was something I did a while back with Mitchell Energy
back when things got slow. Someone came
to me and asked me if I wanted to do a paper on it. At the time it was pretty competitive and no
one else was really doing it. When I was
at Amoco, we developed some of the Bone Spring Fields and I knew they (Amoco)
had some core. I got permission from
them to look at the core even though nobody else would release anything. They were really good about that and they
shipped the core out to my office on pallets and said all they wanted was a
copy of the paper. I had enough to do
the paper with and I made sure I did it right.
It took a long time to do it but Mitchell Energy gave me the time to do
it. It’s really important to do
something like this every now and again. I've also given a few talks on it at the symposium over here (WTGS
Symposium) in town and they were so well received because they were pertinent
talks dealing with everyday things instead of having some person go up there peddling something which is about 80% of the talks. This was a talk about a prospect and how it
was developed, how it was done, and the mapping as well as being successful
which is always a good thing. </div>
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(laughter)</div>
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<b>TG: </b>And I did another thing like it in a packed room. I was a nervous wreck. There were all these people there who just
wanted to see something practical. I
tried to get some of my peers to do this but it is really difficult to get
people to do this. To put the time in to
do it right. I enjoyed it even though it
was really hard to do. I did another one
and it was the same way. It was
something challenging and I always like to challenge myself. To get it done was really good. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Is this something you would recommend today’s
professional to take on?</div>
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<b>TG: </b>Absolutely. And I
encourage management from the companies to allow this. If it’s not competitive let them talk about
it. Give them the chance to do it and
they will be great at it. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> I had always heard that the best way to learn something
better was to teach it. </div>
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<b>TG:</b> Absolutely. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Awesome! OK, if
you could pass something along to the newer generation of oil professionals,
what would it be?</div>
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<b>TG: </b>One thing I see that’s being overlooked is that they
rely on a computer too much. This is
especially true when it comes to mapping.
I never had a prospect that I turned in with a computer map except for regional
purposes because it cannot take what is in the mind. You have to know what the
definition of a system is in order to map it correctly. You cannot let the computer do it because it
has no idea what it is. I always took
the time to make my own maps. They would
get digitized and put into the computer but it was not computer generated. As a matter of fact, I send a map up to my
own company in Denver the guy was like, “I hadn't seen a map like this in a
year!” I said, “Boys, you’d better get
use to it because that’s the way it’s going to be done!” You have to have the interpretation with the
map or else it’s just a map. I already
see too much of that. And the other
thing like I was talking about is to just go out and look at the rock. See what’s going on around the rig. See what a rig does. What the people are doing out there. The descriptions, shades of colors. Learn this.
How does the equipment work? What
happens when you get gas up in the flare?
You know, that kind of thing. Today’s
new geologists are missing that. There
are some special young kids that are doing that. A friend of mine yesterday, he’s a manager,
told me he sent a kid out there and he’s been out there 19 days. The kid is just loving it. That’s the type of enthusiasm that you really
want to see. It’s rare, but you always
want to get the right person. This is
what I’m seeing that’s missing and it’s sad because the opportunity is
there. Just look around this town. You can almost walk out your door and there
is a rig out there. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> Very cool A lot
of good information here. Are there any
stories you can share with us that you’ve experienced over time?</div>
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<b>TG:</b> Oh yeah. There is a lot! Some scary things and some fun things. I remember I was out with my mudlogger and we
were out having coffee and we were just above our pay zone. We walked out the door and heard this little
bleep of a squeak and they tripped the hole.
We both kind of looked at each other and agreed that there was something
weird about that. They started coming out
the hole and swabbed in the hole. Well
we had cut into the top few inches of this gas sand and they didn't know
it. It started coming to see them. Mud goes everywhere! They had to light the flare and stuff. We finally get it under control and drilled
the rest of that rock out. It was the
most permeable sand I had ever found in the Permian Basin. It had 2 darcies of permeability. It was over pressured. It’s amazing what you can sense when you’re
out there. I’ve also had many a good
driller save my butt like in this other little story I was telling the other
day. They always have the flare line
going out facing the north because of the southern winds we mostly get out here. We were drilling and we had a lot of good gas
in the hole. We might have even been circulating. Well, a cold front came through. One of those Blue Northerns and the flare
started coming back at us. The shakers
and pits were bubbling with gas. I didn't know this but they had supercharged those engines. If there had been a spark ….</div>
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<b>JL:</b> Oh my God.</div>
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<b>TG: </b>We didn't know this until afterwards which is probably
good or I would have fell down on the floor.
The driller got us off just in time.
It’s things like that that can happened by you have to be on the rig
floor to see what’s going on. There’s
nothing like the rush of seeing results from something you've been working on
for months or years. To see it come in
is an amazing deal. </div>
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<i>As we wrapped up our
visit, one the biggest points I got out of this was “Context”. Ted admits that it is no secret that
Technology has and will continue to impact the way geologists do their work;
however, despite these advances without actually spending some time out on the
rig it is difficult to put the data we see online into proper context. In doing this, it increases the ability to be
more effective in our analysis of the data we look at. Also, I agreed that it is important to do
research to better understand what it is we are studying. Companies are well served to allow their geologists
the time and resources to conduct these studies and where applicable pool
resources with other sources. In doing
so, their employees are better prepared for the challenges they face in
extracting that precious commodity that drives the success of their (and so many
others) business, welfare, and future.<o:p></o:p></i></div>
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<i>Thank you so much for
visiting The Oil Patch Post. Mr. Gawloski
has graciously allowed me to post his email address (<a href="mailto:TGawloski@ResoluteEnergy.com">TGawloski@ResoluteEnergy.com</a>) if
you have any questions on anything he discussed or you can comment below. For those new to the field, I encourage you to
talk to folks like Ted. They have a lot
of information to share and it can only help us in the end. <o:p></o:p></i></div>
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<i>BTW, feedback
is always welcomed. I am always looking
for folks to speak with so if you have any recommendations, please let me
know. If you see me, please come up and
say “Hey”. I always love meeting people
and exchanging ideas to be better at what we do.<o:p></o:p></i></div>
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<i>Take care, all!<o:p></o:p></i></div>
Jay Leeperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01802892656137608150noreply@blogger.com5tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6027091683452464010.post-20623420131820233222013-03-31T16:18:00.002-06:002013-04-01T15:37:37.658-06:00TOPP Interview: Mr. Morris Burns, Lobbyist, Business Owner, and Observer<br />
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<i>Hi folks! Welcome to
the first interview for the Oil Patch Post!
I hope you enjoy this interview as I had a blast visiting with our
guest.</i></div>
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<i>On March 29, I had the pleasure of meeting and talking to
Morris Burns. Mr. Burns .. er .. Morris
(He said Mr. Burns is his father. Interesting perception for a guy who said he
was in his 80s) is a long-time oil and gas personality here in the Permian
Basin. He has been a Lobbyist, Business
Owner, and instructor. As someone who
has been a keen observer of the industry for the last nearly 50 years, he was
kind enough to accept my invitation to be the first guest of my little
blog. It is with great pleasure and
humility that I present you with excerpts of our conversation.</i></div>
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<b>JL: </b> This is Jay
Leeper with the Oil Patch Post I have with me at this time Mr. Morse Burns. Mr. Burns is been a regular guest speaker on
the KWEL call-in talk show which you can hear on Tuesday mornings. He also has knowledge of the oil and gas
field here in West Texas. He also has
the distinction of being the very first guest of the Oil Patch Post. Welcome to the show. Mr. Burns, if you don’t mind, would you
please tell us a little about what jobs that you’ve done in the past? How long have you been involved with the oil
and gas field?</div>
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<b>MB: </b> A long time. (Laughter)
I got involved in the mid to late seventies. I had some friends who had a company that put
together to manufacture and distribute unmanned mud logging systems and they
did not promote it. I win in and started
promoting it make a contact for them. We
got the thing going pretty well. In 1981
there are 4500 rigs running. People in the
field say that we are in a boom now but we had 4500 rigs running and so we aren’t
there yet. I wound up owning the company. From ‘81 to ‘86 we were in a slow decline and
then in January of ‘86 Saudi Arabia open the valves as Saudi Arabia was tired
of everyone cheating on their quotas and then they being the swing producer
they flooded the market. I had to take a
job and go to work. I started out with
the West Texas Oil & Gas Association in Abilene lobbying. I was there for 12 years and then I was contacted
by the Permian Basin Petroleum Association here. They entice me to come here to Midland and ‘97
and I ran that until 2006. I’ve done
some other things in the meantime. I ran
the NatCo Training Center doing safety and things like this. The main thing I do now is Defensive Driving. Heaven knows we need that. That is a much harder thing to get certified
to teach. It requires some work. Things that I was doing with companies they
now have their own people to do it. I
now teach it locally for ticket abatement and for insurance purposes. I do this for the oil companies and for just
people who need it. I’ll be teaching classes
in Marfa and Lamesa in the next two weeks.
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<b>JL:</b> Do you ever slow down?</div>
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<b>MB:</b> I do not sit and look at walls very well.</div>
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(laughter)</div>
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<b>JL:</b> What other past jobs have you held?</div>
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<b>MB:</b> Well, like I
said, I started a company called FerreTronics.
We found out the name of the company was too esoteric. Nobody knew what that was. They didn’t know what a Ferret was. It was funny because we would sit around try
to figure out how to promote it and we would laugh saying if you pass gas we
will know it. Well, like I said, I also
ran the West Texas Oil & Gas Association, the NatCO Training Center until
NatCO sold that to Cameron. Defensive
Driving is what I do mostly right now. I
do some public relations work with people.
I have one guy I’m working with who is trying to sell gallons of crude
oil to research facilities and I’m helping him work out some information on
that. It’s kind of like shooting pool. It’s been any ball in any pocket.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> We were talking earlier about observations of the oil
and gas field. What trends do you see
coming?</div>
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<b>MB:</b> Technology now is
tremendous. When we first started out we
would rent these on a daily rental fee.
We would take our recorder and measure in 2” increments which would be
the same as the geolograph for the geologist to compare our hydrocarbon
readings with the drilling breaks in the geolograph. It was not a chromatograph. At that time mudloggers would get $500 a day
in and we would $100 a day. We were blowing
and going there for awhile. I went to
the world oil show in Dallas in December of ‘81. That was the absolute peak.</div>
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<b>JL:</b> Awesome! If you
don’t mind, what are some of the main differences you see between today’s
professionals and the professionals of your day?</div>
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<b>MB: </b>The technology advances are tremendous. When we were logging a well it was logged on
site. And then you took the logs to town
and a set them out on the desk and looked at them. If you were a geologist and wanted to see the
information real time you had to sit there on the well. Now the information is transmitted over the
Internet. When I first started the only
field communication was a mobile phone and a mobile operator. You had repeater towers but they weren’t
close enough for continuous information so you had to use an answering service. Those women in the answering service knew me
and knew my habits and better than my wife.
They can find me anywhere and tell me that I got a phone call from so
and so. One Thanksgiving I had everyone
gone. It was just me and I was in the
field. Every time I got back I had a
message from the answering service. Well
I was trying to watch the Texas A&M football game and my wife and daughter
were visiting her parents in Levelland.
The answering service would call me and said that they hate to keep
bothering me on Thanksgiving but I said, “No ma’am. I’m giving thanks.” But like I said, the technology has changed
and you can get much more comprehensive logs.
It makes things go so much faster now a days. Water flooding and CO2 flooding have changed the
field. And so has fracking. It’s funny I hear the news media talking
about this new controversial oil drilling technique. It’s not new.
It’s been in the oil patch since 1947.
It wasn’t controversial for the first 50 years until the green folks
found out we were making cracks in the ground.
And it’s not a drilling technique.
It was originally used as a stimulation technique. Now it’s used as a completion technique. It’s the only proven way we can get oil and
gas out of shale. These are just some of
the changes and I’m sure we’ll see more and more overtime.<br />
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<b>JL:</b> What about the
professionals today? Are they pretty
well prepared for the challenges of today?<br />
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<b>MB: </b> Yeah. You know it was funny and ’79, ‘80 to ‘81 if
someone got out of college with an engineering or a geology degree unless they
were just the village idiot they would go straight to the oilfield and the
village idiots went to work in the railroad commission because the village
idiots did know the difference between a pump jack and a railroad track so they
went in the railroad commission. We had
to “train” some of these folks. And we’re
getting back to that point. I spoke to a
group from UTPB. I took them on a tour
of the Petroleum Museum and when we wrapped up I asked them if they had any
questions. One kid asked me, “Is this
going to last?” I told him, “Yeah. You got a job for as long as you want to work.” With this Cline Shale just barely getting
started it is a huge, huge formation. It’s
100 miles long and 75 miles wide and according to the San Antonio Express News
the depth of this formation as 250 to 500 feet.
They said it was like 10 Eagle Fords stacked one on top of each other. It’s just a huge formation and we’re just
getting started. </div>
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<b>JL:</b> WOW! I have just
a few more questions and I got a lot of feedback on this one. If you could pass something on to today’s
professional to better help them, what would it be?</div>
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<b>MB: </b>Get in something and stay with it. Loyalty will not be included in the next printed
version of the Oxford dictionary. There’s
no loyalty from employer to employee or from employee to employer. It’s really sad. We’ve seen people stay with the company from
the time they get hired until they retired.
The company would take care of them.
We used to say that companies would change crude oil suppliers for the
difference of a nickel and now we see the same thing with employees. There is no loyalty from the employer to the
employee or up or down. It’s really a
shame. I really hate that. Be a valuable person to the company and learn
as much as you can. Greed is a terrible
thing. There is plenty of money to go
around. Get with something you enjoy
doing. I liked going to the field. There was a driller on one of the rigs and
when I would walk up on him he would say “Ohh, no! Not you again! I would rather see a rattlesnake come on site
than you.” We would banter back and forth.
There was a time I went out on rig and it was covered in ice and it was
a clear day and it was just beautiful. I
wish I had a camera. I know that people
say that rigs will scare off the wild animals but there was a time when I went out
and I saw a doe and a fawn right by the rig road. As I got close, she whistled, ran off, and
the fawn dropped trying to camouflage itself.
I got as close to it as I was to you (about 4 feet) and it never
moved. And the people out on these rigs they’re
wonderful. Do something that you have
fun doing and that you’re good at. </div>
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<b>JL: </b> Awesome. One last question. Do you have any cool stories that you’d like
to tell us about? I’m always looking for
cool stories. Does anything come to mind
that you’d like to share with us?</div>
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<b>MB: </b> O goodness. It was interesting when I was a lobbying. Working with other people I always got into
it with other associations. We would go
to Washington and someone would say, “Hey, let’s take a Charlie Rangel to lunch.” Charlie Rangel will eat our steak and drink
our whisky but he is never ever going to vote for us. I wanted to talk to people who we could
persuade to help us because he is never going to help us and the other
associations would still do it. I wasn’t
going to contribute my association’s hard earned money to that. Any time and every time I went into his
office, Lamar Smith would come out and greet us personally. At that time, they had Midland and Odessa
split up into three congressional districts so that we couldn’t get someone
from here elected. They didn’t want
someone from Midland or Odessa in Congress making decisions. In all it’s been very interesting. I’ve known two presidents on a first name
basis and I’ve known six governors on a first name basis. While I was with the association I really got
to meet the movers and shakers. It was
great being a part of that.</div>
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<i>Admittedly, there was a lot of other discussion we kicked
around that I didn’t get into the interview, but I have to admit that I learned
a lot. As we parted ways, I reflected on how people like Morris have a lot to
offer the younger generation of professionals and I have to encourage all of us
to take every opportunity to try to sit down with these folks and pick their
brains as what they know is relevant to us today. There is a lot we will lose in the near
future as these folks will no longer be accessible and it is up to us to honor
their contributions If you have any questions for Morris, you can put them in the comment sections or email him at morrisburns@sbcglobal.net . I know he'd be glad to hear from you. </i></div>
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<i>Thank you for taking some time to read this post. I hope you have found it worthwhile and not
too many typos. Like any worthwhile endeavor and like the oil field, this will evolve. Into what, I have no idea but you have an influence. Any feedback is
appreciated and hopefully I’ll be able to see you out and about.</i></div>
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<i>Take care, all!</i></div>
Jay Leeperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01802892656137608150noreply@blogger.com2tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6027091683452464010.post-48547138940103141992013-02-15T10:51:00.002-06:002013-02-15T10:51:33.338-06:00Welcome to The Oil Patch PostHello all. Welcome to The Oil Patch Post. It is my hope to be able to (at least monthly) be able to post interviews with experienced people in the Oil and Gas industry. If I can get anyone to visit with me, I hope to be able to get their take on the Field now and in the near future, see what advice they can offer to the new generation of oil men, and seek out any interesting stories they may wish to share. While the first set of people I may speak with are people I know, I'd be very interested in hearing recommendations from you regarding people I might try to meet with. Also, what kind of questions would you like asked? In the end, this is for us to learn a thing or two.<br />
<br />
Thanks for dropping by a spell. Hopefully, I'll be seeing you out in the patch!Jay Leeperhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01802892656137608150noreply@blogger.com0